1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:08,469 foreign 2 00:00:00,500 --> 00:00:08,469 [Music] 3 00:00:11,400 --> 00:00:16,859 welcome back everyone it's my very great 4 00:00:14,580 --> 00:00:19,199 pleasure now to introduce to you all 5 00:00:16,859 --> 00:00:21,300 Donna Benjamin a passionate advocate of 6 00:00:19,199 --> 00:00:23,160 free and open source software over the 7 00:00:21,300 --> 00:00:25,920 last two decades they've seen how open 8 00:00:23,160 --> 00:00:27,599 agile hybrid and distributed ways of 9 00:00:25,920 --> 00:00:30,060 working thinking and organizing human 10 00:00:27,599 --> 00:00:33,239 Collective Endeavor have literally 11 00:00:30,060 --> 00:00:35,100 changed everything in today's talk Donna 12 00:00:33,239 --> 00:00:36,899 will explore these ideas and how we 13 00:00:35,100 --> 00:00:38,520 might continue to pursue positive open 14 00:00:36,899 --> 00:00:42,250 and inclusive change for the future 15 00:00:38,520 --> 00:00:45,479 please welcome Donna thank you Fiona 16 00:00:42,250 --> 00:00:45,479 [Applause] 17 00:00:46,559 --> 00:00:51,180 I would like to acknowledge the 18 00:00:49,020 --> 00:00:53,640 traditional custodians of the land on 19 00:00:51,180 --> 00:00:55,020 which we live and just 20 00:00:53,640 --> 00:00:56,520 take a Beat 21 00:00:55,020 --> 00:00:58,320 feel 22 00:00:56,520 --> 00:01:02,660 deep time 23 00:00:58,320 --> 00:01:02,660 but we're all here now so let's move on 24 00:01:02,940 --> 00:01:09,659 if you have a device handy please feel 25 00:01:07,080 --> 00:01:11,820 free and don't if you don't want to grab 26 00:01:09,659 --> 00:01:15,420 that QR code and and it will take you 27 00:01:11,820 --> 00:01:17,460 straight there or go to slido.com and 28 00:01:15,420 --> 00:01:20,100 enter in that number I'll have a little 29 00:01:17,460 --> 00:01:23,400 bit of audience participation and a 30 00:01:20,100 --> 00:01:25,140 little bit of audience feedback so 31 00:01:23,400 --> 00:01:27,240 um 32 00:01:25,140 --> 00:01:29,640 oh 33 00:01:27,240 --> 00:01:33,000 what I want to do before I get into it 34 00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:34,920 is of the three talks that you could be 35 00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:37,560 in right now 36 00:01:34,920 --> 00:01:39,659 why this one 37 00:01:37,560 --> 00:01:41,220 and what do you hope to get out of it 38 00:01:39,659 --> 00:01:43,200 today 39 00:01:41,220 --> 00:01:44,640 why did you come to my talk and what are 40 00:01:43,200 --> 00:01:47,880 you hoping to get out of it today now 41 00:01:44,640 --> 00:01:50,159 this is not a test of you this is just 42 00:01:47,880 --> 00:01:52,680 to give me a bit of a sense of of what's 43 00:01:50,159 --> 00:01:55,020 going on it also I apologize in advance 44 00:01:52,680 --> 00:01:57,360 if I totally fail to meet your 45 00:01:55,020 --> 00:02:00,259 expectations 46 00:01:57,360 --> 00:02:03,720 which is highly likely so this is about 47 00:02:00,259 --> 00:02:06,119 expectation management please lower them 48 00:02:03,720 --> 00:02:07,740 no no not low enough lower 49 00:02:06,119 --> 00:02:09,899 a little bit lower 50 00:02:07,740 --> 00:02:12,360 okay good all right we're all good so 51 00:02:09,899 --> 00:02:15,420 yeah just feel free to you know jump in 52 00:02:12,360 --> 00:02:18,060 there put in a few thoughts or 53 00:02:15,420 --> 00:02:21,000 completely ignore it you are free agents 54 00:02:18,060 --> 00:02:21,840 so with that 55 00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:24,780 um 56 00:02:21,840 --> 00:02:26,819 I made this promise to the conference 57 00:02:24,780 --> 00:02:30,120 and to you about what I was going to 58 00:02:26,819 --> 00:02:34,739 talk about today my title open agile 59 00:02:30,120 --> 00:02:37,440 hybrid and distributed and that's the 60 00:02:34,739 --> 00:02:42,379 abstract that I wrote 61 00:02:37,440 --> 00:02:46,260 and then I got accepted and went um yeah 62 00:02:42,379 --> 00:02:49,200 so let's see where we end up right 63 00:02:46,260 --> 00:02:51,599 we live in Revolutionary times that's 64 00:02:49,200 --> 00:02:53,819 the assertion that I made but what do we 65 00:02:51,599 --> 00:02:55,920 mean by Revolution I don't want you to 66 00:02:53,819 --> 00:02:56,760 think about the nasty ones like where 67 00:02:55,920 --> 00:02:59,099 people 68 00:02:56,760 --> 00:03:01,019 lost their heads don't think about that 69 00:02:59,099 --> 00:03:03,180 think about 70 00:03:01,019 --> 00:03:06,300 um scientific revolutions and how 71 00:03:03,180 --> 00:03:08,580 knowledge has changed I found this great 72 00:03:06,300 --> 00:03:11,700 article by this chap called Thornton May 73 00:03:08,580 --> 00:03:14,640 who's apparently a futurist always an 74 00:03:11,700 --> 00:03:16,739 interesting term but I.T and the forever 75 00:03:14,640 --> 00:03:18,900 Revolution that actually the world of 76 00:03:16,739 --> 00:03:20,700 technology is in constant change and 77 00:03:18,900 --> 00:03:22,920 constantly having an impact right so I 78 00:03:20,700 --> 00:03:24,900 think that was interesting but also just 79 00:03:22,920 --> 00:03:27,599 understanding Revolution and not just 80 00:03:24,900 --> 00:03:30,120 the kind of big bit that kind of makes 81 00:03:27,599 --> 00:03:31,920 news headlines or the history books but 82 00:03:30,120 --> 00:03:35,340 the before 83 00:03:31,920 --> 00:03:37,860 and more importantly the after what 84 00:03:35,340 --> 00:03:39,780 happens after a revolution when 85 00:03:37,860 --> 00:03:43,200 everything has changed and we're living 86 00:03:39,780 --> 00:03:44,459 in a New Normal a phrase We may have 87 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:46,680 heard a little 88 00:03:44,459 --> 00:03:49,379 too often of late 89 00:03:46,680 --> 00:03:53,040 so we live in Revolutionary times 90 00:03:49,379 --> 00:03:55,260 what does revolution mean and is that do 91 00:03:53,040 --> 00:03:57,659 we really so this is more about 92 00:03:55,260 --> 00:03:58,980 questions than answers so a few 93 00:03:57,659 --> 00:04:01,620 different things to think about that I 94 00:03:58,980 --> 00:04:06,060 like this radical idealism 95 00:04:01,620 --> 00:04:08,879 and its tragic consequences hmm 96 00:04:06,060 --> 00:04:09,780 so when we started our tools will play 97 00:04:08,879 --> 00:04:11,700 things 98 00:04:09,780 --> 00:04:13,620 Hobbies 99 00:04:11,700 --> 00:04:16,320 again an assertion that I made in my 100 00:04:13,620 --> 00:04:17,479 abstract so hopefully you managed to get 101 00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:20,940 into 102 00:04:17,479 --> 00:04:23,160 slido and now I'd like you to join the 103 00:04:20,940 --> 00:04:27,240 quiz so I just want to test a couple of 104 00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:29,100 those ideas in that assertion oh that's 105 00:04:27,240 --> 00:04:32,699 gone one too far 106 00:04:29,100 --> 00:04:34,259 one too far where did it go 107 00:04:32,699 --> 00:04:37,139 all right everything goes heavily okay 108 00:04:34,259 --> 00:04:38,699 people hello great so what were our 109 00:04:37,139 --> 00:04:39,600 tools I'm missing one of my questions 110 00:04:38,699 --> 00:04:42,660 here 111 00:04:39,600 --> 00:04:44,040 oh well well we're our tools say when 112 00:04:42,660 --> 00:04:47,540 when we started our tools we'll play 113 00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:47,540 Things Hobbies what were our tools 114 00:04:48,419 --> 00:04:53,100 give you a moment 115 00:04:50,520 --> 00:04:55,080 I'll get a sign I'll kind of Intuit a 116 00:04:53,100 --> 00:04:59,479 sign from the audience when a majority 117 00:04:55,080 --> 00:04:59,479 of you have completed the task 118 00:05:00,720 --> 00:05:04,680 people still mostly heads down or 119 00:05:03,120 --> 00:05:07,199 they're Tweeting or they're going this 120 00:05:04,680 --> 00:05:09,979 is rubbish why am I here 121 00:05:07,199 --> 00:05:09,979 laughs 122 00:05:10,020 --> 00:05:14,759 all right let's see are we ready is 123 00:05:12,600 --> 00:05:17,160 anyone like no no I'm not done 124 00:05:14,759 --> 00:05:19,199 all right okay 125 00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:20,940 oh I must be going in the wrong 126 00:05:19,199 --> 00:05:22,740 direction let's try that again 127 00:05:20,940 --> 00:05:24,960 up 128 00:05:22,740 --> 00:05:26,580 Gremlins 129 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:29,940 no it's not giving me the answers all 130 00:05:26,580 --> 00:05:31,320 right fine I'm just gonna continue on so 131 00:05:29,940 --> 00:05:32,820 when we started our tools we'll play 132 00:05:31,320 --> 00:05:34,199 things and hobbies and what we missed I 133 00:05:32,820 --> 00:05:36,780 the first question I had was well when 134 00:05:34,199 --> 00:05:39,660 did we start we'll do this by hand I 135 00:05:36,780 --> 00:05:42,660 said was it 1983 136 00:05:39,660 --> 00:05:45,060 was it 1998 137 00:05:42,660 --> 00:05:46,440 or was it one and a half million years 138 00:05:45,060 --> 00:05:50,539 ago 139 00:05:46,440 --> 00:05:50,539 or D all of the above 140 00:05:59,160 --> 00:06:04,680 medieval I mean pineapple slime becoming 141 00:06:01,860 --> 00:06:07,680 uh what we are today love it to repeat 142 00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:09,539 for the for the camp for the live stream 143 00:06:07,680 --> 00:06:12,360 and the recording it wasn't just play 144 00:06:09,539 --> 00:06:14,759 things it was when we crawled out of the 145 00:06:12,360 --> 00:06:17,639 midi out of our medie evil not many 146 00:06:14,759 --> 00:06:20,940 Prime Evil Prime Evil slime yes lovely 147 00:06:17,639 --> 00:06:24,180 okay so yes when did we start well 148 00:06:20,940 --> 00:06:26,900 probably when we became human 149 00:06:24,180 --> 00:06:29,400 but with open source 150 00:06:26,900 --> 00:06:31,500 there's this idea of The Accidental 151 00:06:29,400 --> 00:06:32,819 revolutionary of Linus Torvalds and he 152 00:06:31,500 --> 00:06:34,319 named his book 153 00:06:32,819 --> 00:06:35,600 just for fun 154 00:06:34,319 --> 00:06:38,220 so there was this sense of 155 00:06:35,600 --> 00:06:40,680 experimentation and fun and just kind of 156 00:06:38,220 --> 00:06:45,380 learning and figuring things out at the 157 00:06:40,680 --> 00:06:45,380 start but we've moved on and now 158 00:06:45,539 --> 00:06:49,340 okay 159 00:06:46,919 --> 00:06:49,340 oh 160 00:06:50,160 --> 00:06:54,720 so 161 00:06:51,419 --> 00:06:57,180 this idea of fun 162 00:06:54,720 --> 00:06:58,680 how and why was it fun what was fun 163 00:06:57,180 --> 00:07:01,940 about it 164 00:06:58,680 --> 00:07:01,940 who was it fun for 165 00:07:02,639 --> 00:07:07,560 was it fun for everyone was it equally 166 00:07:05,340 --> 00:07:10,740 fun for everyone 167 00:07:07,560 --> 00:07:12,840 so this idea of Open Source and like 168 00:07:10,740 --> 00:07:14,819 lennis's kind of Almost Famous words 169 00:07:12,840 --> 00:07:16,680 when he released it is that you know 170 00:07:14,819 --> 00:07:19,680 this won't be big and famous or anything 171 00:07:16,680 --> 00:07:21,780 it's just a hobby it's just for fun as 172 00:07:19,680 --> 00:07:25,020 his book was titled 173 00:07:21,780 --> 00:07:27,120 but it was it was the seed that you know 174 00:07:25,020 --> 00:07:28,620 that that was planted which has grown 175 00:07:27,120 --> 00:07:31,380 into something which consists stay in 176 00:07:28,620 --> 00:07:33,720 conferences like this this week but 177 00:07:31,380 --> 00:07:34,620 conferences like this all around the 178 00:07:33,720 --> 00:07:37,020 world 179 00:07:34,620 --> 00:07:38,639 and that was sustained even when things 180 00:07:37,020 --> 00:07:40,380 got difficult and we couldn't meet in 181 00:07:38,639 --> 00:07:43,199 person you know there were online 182 00:07:40,380 --> 00:07:45,360 versions so a seed was planted which 183 00:07:43,199 --> 00:07:47,099 created this this thing which has led to 184 00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:48,479 everything open which we've been talking 185 00:07:47,099 --> 00:07:51,120 about this week 186 00:07:48,479 --> 00:07:53,300 give me some thoughts how and why was it 187 00:07:51,120 --> 00:07:53,300 fun 188 00:08:00,300 --> 00:08:04,620 always connected 189 00:08:02,520 --> 00:08:07,800 and the linkages are so clear beautiful 190 00:08:04,620 --> 00:08:10,340 Kat has said we learn through play and 191 00:08:07,800 --> 00:08:10,340 the linkages 192 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:19,259 and the linkages are clear between play 193 00:08:14,400 --> 00:08:21,979 and fun although not always nice yes yes 194 00:08:19,259 --> 00:08:21,979 we learn 195 00:08:22,740 --> 00:08:25,340 yes 196 00:08:36,860 --> 00:08:43,979 yes so working in like Enterprise kind 197 00:08:41,820 --> 00:08:48,180 of set up 198 00:08:43,979 --> 00:08:51,000 um Linux and open source or fast was 199 00:08:48,180 --> 00:08:52,920 just kind of fun in the sense of this is 200 00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:55,459 something I did after hours and it was 201 00:08:52,920 --> 00:08:58,560 slightly subversive 202 00:08:55,459 --> 00:09:00,899 slightly subversive I like that 203 00:08:58,560 --> 00:09:03,000 especially in the context of we live in 204 00:09:00,899 --> 00:09:06,420 Revolutionary times 205 00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:09,420 okay thank you 206 00:09:06,420 --> 00:09:12,779 so from fun to fundamental 207 00:09:09,420 --> 00:09:16,080 infrastructure our tools open source now 208 00:09:12,779 --> 00:09:20,060 Powers the planet it is it has become 209 00:09:16,080 --> 00:09:20,060 kind of almost ubiquitous 210 00:09:20,279 --> 00:09:25,740 and with that comes a level of 211 00:09:23,160 --> 00:09:28,260 responsibility that perhaps 212 00:09:25,740 --> 00:09:30,660 we didn't necessarily sign up for at the 213 00:09:28,260 --> 00:09:35,420 beginning when we released some code 214 00:09:30,660 --> 00:09:35,420 into the commons for people to use 215 00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:42,360 so I started I got these four words in 216 00:09:40,260 --> 00:09:44,459 my title open is the first one and we've 217 00:09:42,360 --> 00:09:47,760 been at a conference or well not most of 218 00:09:44,459 --> 00:09:49,200 the week called Everything open this is 219 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:51,720 from you know this is from the free 220 00:09:49,200 --> 00:09:54,300 software project talking about the 221 00:09:51,720 --> 00:09:57,680 different kinds of open the the contrast 222 00:09:54,300 --> 00:10:00,839 with free software non-free software 223 00:09:57,680 --> 00:10:03,120 released private software but open 224 00:10:00,839 --> 00:10:05,760 source is probably you know one of the 225 00:10:03,120 --> 00:10:07,740 the kind of fundamental opens in 226 00:10:05,760 --> 00:10:12,600 everything open but we've heard about 227 00:10:07,740 --> 00:10:14,640 others this week and our lovely keynote 228 00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:16,019 yesterday from Seb Chaney had this slide 229 00:10:14,640 --> 00:10:18,300 up and I thought I've gotta I've got to 230 00:10:16,019 --> 00:10:21,839 add that in open collections open 231 00:10:18,300 --> 00:10:24,180 curation open source 232 00:10:21,839 --> 00:10:26,160 one of the other opens and I just kind 233 00:10:24,180 --> 00:10:28,019 of trolled the program trying to kind of 234 00:10:26,160 --> 00:10:30,000 summarize some of the different opens 235 00:10:28,019 --> 00:10:32,459 we've been talking about 236 00:10:30,000 --> 00:10:33,959 um over the past three days they were 237 00:10:32,459 --> 00:10:35,519 some that I could clearly see but are 238 00:10:33,959 --> 00:10:37,320 there others I want to you know shout 239 00:10:35,519 --> 00:10:39,540 out are there other opens that we've 240 00:10:37,320 --> 00:10:42,720 talked about we've heard about we've 241 00:10:39,540 --> 00:10:45,420 learned about we've puzzled over 242 00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:47,640 open Hardware big one Monday there was a 243 00:10:45,420 --> 00:10:50,700 whole whole kind of stream a whole 244 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:53,720 activity about open Hardware 245 00:10:50,700 --> 00:10:53,720 any others 246 00:10:54,060 --> 00:10:57,779 it's one that I haven't heard about but 247 00:10:56,100 --> 00:10:59,760 I've heard about in other context of 248 00:10:57,779 --> 00:11:02,640 Open Leadership and how that differs 249 00:10:59,760 --> 00:11:05,100 from just leadership and I think that 250 00:11:02,640 --> 00:11:06,300 that little phrase I just used how that 251 00:11:05,100 --> 00:11:08,220 differs 252 00:11:06,300 --> 00:11:11,700 how do any of these differ from the 253 00:11:08,220 --> 00:11:12,800 thing without open in front in some 254 00:11:11,700 --> 00:11:15,899 cases 255 00:11:12,800 --> 00:11:19,140 open is becoming the default in others 256 00:11:15,899 --> 00:11:21,600 it's still woof like cats just spoken 257 00:11:19,140 --> 00:11:23,880 about with open education resources and 258 00:11:21,600 --> 00:11:25,920 how difficult it is for some of the 259 00:11:23,880 --> 00:11:27,720 people in the academic space to accept 260 00:11:25,920 --> 00:11:30,540 and understand 261 00:11:27,720 --> 00:11:33,540 what open means and what open means for 262 00:11:30,540 --> 00:11:36,060 them I think it's really interesting 263 00:11:33,540 --> 00:11:37,440 I'm so delighted by you know when this 264 00:11:36,060 --> 00:11:39,600 conference was announced oh yeah 265 00:11:37,440 --> 00:11:42,180 everything open okay let's go let's rock 266 00:11:39,600 --> 00:11:45,480 so yeah open thinking about that from 267 00:11:42,180 --> 00:11:47,880 open I want to move into agile and the 268 00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:50,399 agile Manifesto coming back to 269 00:11:47,880 --> 00:11:52,680 Revolutions right the agile Manifesto 270 00:11:50,399 --> 00:11:54,839 now hands up if you have heard of the 271 00:11:52,680 --> 00:11:57,959 agile Manifesto and the bunch of blokes 272 00:11:54,839 --> 00:12:00,779 who hung out in a ski chalet 22 years 273 00:11:57,959 --> 00:12:03,980 ago and came up with this and put up the 274 00:12:00,779 --> 00:12:03,980 world's worst website 275 00:12:07,820 --> 00:12:12,180 manifesto.org has not changed but it's 276 00:12:10,560 --> 00:12:14,399 really you know the individuals and 277 00:12:12,180 --> 00:12:17,279 interactions working software customer 278 00:12:14,399 --> 00:12:19,440 collaboration responding to change these 279 00:12:17,279 --> 00:12:21,420 things have become 280 00:12:19,440 --> 00:12:23,459 very common 281 00:12:21,420 --> 00:12:25,260 and I like to say that I think about 282 00:12:23,459 --> 00:12:28,079 open source 283 00:12:25,260 --> 00:12:31,440 and agile methodology as the twin 284 00:12:28,079 --> 00:12:33,959 Revolutions of technology and together 285 00:12:31,440 --> 00:12:36,240 they have both had this massive impact 286 00:12:33,959 --> 00:12:38,279 and if we compare what we think of as 287 00:12:36,240 --> 00:12:41,279 the world of technology today with what 288 00:12:38,279 --> 00:12:44,040 it was in say the 1970s and the 1980s 289 00:12:41,279 --> 00:12:46,380 and the way software was created then 290 00:12:44,040 --> 00:12:50,100 it's a bit different and I think that 291 00:12:46,380 --> 00:12:51,720 these two kind of threads uh you know 292 00:12:50,100 --> 00:12:54,779 have a 293 00:12:51,720 --> 00:12:56,820 are responsible for that change maybe 294 00:12:54,779 --> 00:12:59,760 that's a bold statement but it feels 295 00:12:56,820 --> 00:13:02,760 right to me but get they have a lot in 296 00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:05,220 common but the communities 297 00:13:02,760 --> 00:13:07,740 are completely different like if you go 298 00:13:05,220 --> 00:13:12,240 hang out at agile events they're real 299 00:13:07,740 --> 00:13:15,060 different to open Saucy kinds of events 300 00:13:12,240 --> 00:13:17,339 and yet so much of what we do and where 301 00:13:15,060 --> 00:13:19,380 we you know the the worlds that we work 302 00:13:17,339 --> 00:13:20,760 in are similar so I think it's I think 303 00:13:19,380 --> 00:13:22,920 that's another interesting thread so 304 00:13:20,760 --> 00:13:26,940 we've impacted each other but perhaps 305 00:13:22,920 --> 00:13:29,700 indirectly rather than directly 306 00:13:26,940 --> 00:13:32,700 so from agile 307 00:13:29,700 --> 00:13:36,000 I wanted to acknowledge that it's also 308 00:13:32,700 --> 00:13:39,899 become a really dirty word 309 00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:41,579 used and abused and misused 310 00:13:39,899 --> 00:13:45,120 a lot 311 00:13:41,579 --> 00:13:47,040 ah a lot so I went back to the etymology 312 00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:50,519 and this I always love this right you 313 00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:53,880 get into it oh Old Norse says to drive 314 00:13:50,519 --> 00:13:55,440 middle Irish to battle but the bit up 315 00:13:53,880 --> 00:13:58,920 here it's probably too small for you to 316 00:13:55,440 --> 00:14:03,060 read but to set in motion 317 00:13:58,920 --> 00:14:05,579 and to keep in movement movement also 318 00:14:03,060 --> 00:14:06,720 back to Revolution to keep in movement 319 00:14:05,579 --> 00:14:09,240 and I think 320 00:14:06,720 --> 00:14:11,880 also to keep in movement you have to 321 00:14:09,240 --> 00:14:14,579 have some degree of sustainability you 322 00:14:11,880 --> 00:14:16,560 can't be you can't Sprint all the time 323 00:14:14,579 --> 00:14:18,360 maybe that's a bit of an anti-agile 324 00:14:16,560 --> 00:14:19,860 right in some ways but to keep in 325 00:14:18,360 --> 00:14:22,139 movement you have to have some element 326 00:14:19,860 --> 00:14:23,100 of sustainability let's also think back 327 00:14:22,139 --> 00:14:25,920 to that 328 00:14:23,100 --> 00:14:28,800 picture of planet Earth and how we power 329 00:14:25,920 --> 00:14:30,720 our planet and how some things are kind 330 00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:33,660 of killing our planet like fossil fuel 331 00:14:30,720 --> 00:14:37,200 driven climate change but how open 332 00:14:33,660 --> 00:14:39,839 source open code and communities are 333 00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:42,600 also tackling those kinds of challenges 334 00:14:39,839 --> 00:14:45,000 anyway I digress agile the etymology 335 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:46,500 back to the what does that word really 336 00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:48,899 mean 337 00:14:46,500 --> 00:14:51,360 there's also 338 00:14:48,899 --> 00:14:53,399 another meaning Maria the Doberman does 339 00:14:51,360 --> 00:14:55,800 agility training it's just a very 340 00:14:53,399 --> 00:14:58,860 physical thing about having you know 341 00:14:55,800 --> 00:15:00,779 being agile in agility training and what 342 00:14:58,860 --> 00:15:03,360 does that mean right this is only kind 343 00:15:00,779 --> 00:15:05,899 of pull these words apart before we put 344 00:15:03,360 --> 00:15:05,899 them back together 345 00:15:06,839 --> 00:15:11,820 but there was a before the blokes at the 346 00:15:09,779 --> 00:15:13,079 ski chalet came up with the agile 347 00:15:11,820 --> 00:15:16,199 Manifesto 348 00:15:13,079 --> 00:15:18,540 found this article some time back and I 349 00:15:16,199 --> 00:15:21,540 absolutely loved it talks about the work 350 00:15:18,540 --> 00:15:25,199 of sister Karina Kent talking about 351 00:15:21,540 --> 00:15:28,380 um an art room and rules for art and 352 00:15:25,199 --> 00:15:30,660 Octavia Butler these these women 353 00:15:28,380 --> 00:15:34,800 um wrote about creativity collaboration 354 00:15:30,660 --> 00:15:37,199 in ways that sort of very much echoed in 355 00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:40,079 in the the values and the principles of 356 00:15:37,199 --> 00:15:42,480 the agile Manifesto much further like 357 00:15:40,079 --> 00:15:44,699 much further ago in the past 358 00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:46,380 and there was this one line at the end 359 00:15:44,699 --> 00:15:47,820 of the article they they talk about 360 00:15:46,380 --> 00:15:50,519 opening doors 361 00:15:47,820 --> 00:15:51,899 rather than selling keys 362 00:15:50,519 --> 00:15:53,459 and I think that's one thing I talk 363 00:15:51,899 --> 00:15:55,500 about agile being a bit of a dirty word 364 00:15:53,459 --> 00:15:58,560 it's become this kind of 365 00:15:55,500 --> 00:16:01,380 agile industrial complex 366 00:15:58,560 --> 00:16:03,779 of Frameworks and certifications and 367 00:16:01,380 --> 00:16:05,579 paying lots of money to people to get 368 00:16:03,779 --> 00:16:08,519 get your tick 369 00:16:05,579 --> 00:16:10,320 but there's something in it which goes 370 00:16:08,519 --> 00:16:12,360 back further 371 00:16:10,320 --> 00:16:16,040 in history and 372 00:16:12,360 --> 00:16:16,040 is useful I think 373 00:16:17,339 --> 00:16:22,380 so from that buzzword to the next 374 00:16:19,980 --> 00:16:25,019 hybrid 375 00:16:22,380 --> 00:16:28,139 hybrid 376 00:16:25,019 --> 00:16:29,940 my current employer and fabulous sponsor 377 00:16:28,139 --> 00:16:32,760 of this conference talks about the open 378 00:16:29,940 --> 00:16:35,100 hybrid cloud 379 00:16:32,760 --> 00:16:38,339 what does that mean 380 00:16:35,100 --> 00:16:39,899 I drive a hybrid car what one of them 381 00:16:38,339 --> 00:16:41,639 it's actually that color too 382 00:16:39,899 --> 00:16:43,980 I'm really interested in how we're going 383 00:16:41,639 --> 00:16:45,899 to do hybrid events and hybrid workshops 384 00:16:43,980 --> 00:16:48,360 you know talking about you know the 385 00:16:45,899 --> 00:16:51,779 online versus the in person and that 386 00:16:48,360 --> 00:16:54,899 kind of messy in-between this hybrid but 387 00:16:51,779 --> 00:16:58,079 but and hybrid you know ways of working 388 00:16:54,899 --> 00:17:00,300 we've got team members who are 389 00:16:58,079 --> 00:17:04,860 my next word 390 00:17:00,300 --> 00:17:07,860 distributed remote virtual I don't like 391 00:17:04,860 --> 00:17:10,199 using the terms virtual or remote remote 392 00:17:07,860 --> 00:17:12,480 makes it sound like they're far away and 393 00:17:10,199 --> 00:17:15,299 something wrong with them and virtual 394 00:17:12,480 --> 00:17:18,240 makes it sound like they're not real 395 00:17:15,299 --> 00:17:19,980 but distributed I think is a good is a 396 00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:21,720 good word to describe when we have 397 00:17:19,980 --> 00:17:23,760 people who are 398 00:17:21,720 --> 00:17:25,500 scattered through time and space whether 399 00:17:23,760 --> 00:17:27,959 it's time zones whether it's geography 400 00:17:25,500 --> 00:17:29,460 but they are distributed distributed is 401 00:17:27,959 --> 00:17:33,059 also a word we've used in the Linux 402 00:17:29,460 --> 00:17:35,880 Community well a version of distribution 403 00:17:33,059 --> 00:17:39,000 distributions of Linux so this idea of 404 00:17:35,880 --> 00:17:42,840 distributed is uh is one that I think is 405 00:17:39,000 --> 00:17:45,320 also kind of becoming part of our new 406 00:17:42,840 --> 00:17:45,320 normal 407 00:17:46,200 --> 00:17:49,679 I'm not actually expecting any of you to 408 00:17:47,940 --> 00:17:51,419 read all of those little words it was 409 00:17:49,679 --> 00:17:55,320 kind of like a brain dump of stuff that 410 00:17:51,419 --> 00:18:00,559 I was gathering together so open 411 00:17:55,320 --> 00:18:00,559 agile hybrid and distributed 412 00:18:01,520 --> 00:18:08,660 ways of working 413 00:18:05,580 --> 00:18:08,660 I love this picture 414 00:18:09,740 --> 00:18:16,080 telegraphists in Melbourne 415 00:18:12,179 --> 00:18:18,900 in the olden days this very specific 416 00:18:16,080 --> 00:18:21,360 time the olden days but ways of working 417 00:18:18,900 --> 00:18:22,799 you know all of those four words right 418 00:18:21,360 --> 00:18:24,660 they're some of the things that have 419 00:18:22,799 --> 00:18:27,419 changed and part of the revolution is 420 00:18:24,660 --> 00:18:29,220 we've kind of there were some people who 421 00:18:27,419 --> 00:18:32,340 were have all you know have always 422 00:18:29,220 --> 00:18:34,799 worked in a distributed way but then 423 00:18:32,340 --> 00:18:36,780 there came everybody 424 00:18:34,799 --> 00:18:38,520 through covert and lockdowns and 425 00:18:36,780 --> 00:18:41,580 figuring out how to work together online 426 00:18:38,520 --> 00:18:43,980 through time and space but also adopting 427 00:18:41,580 --> 00:18:45,600 agile ways of working as opposed to 428 00:18:43,980 --> 00:18:48,780 whatever it was that you were doing 429 00:18:45,600 --> 00:18:50,940 before the waterfall or very 430 00:18:48,780 --> 00:18:53,940 prescriptive here were plans that came 431 00:18:50,940 --> 00:18:56,120 from on high like Moses's tablets and 432 00:18:53,940 --> 00:18:59,700 now you go through iterations to 433 00:18:56,120 --> 00:19:01,980 implement them you know the ways of 434 00:18:59,700 --> 00:19:03,720 working is something that has also 435 00:19:01,980 --> 00:19:07,559 changed that open 436 00:19:03,720 --> 00:19:10,740 and agile have impacted 437 00:19:07,559 --> 00:19:13,440 but not just ways of working 438 00:19:10,740 --> 00:19:16,440 also ways of thinking 439 00:19:13,440 --> 00:19:19,020 and I was a little bit inspired by 440 00:19:16,440 --> 00:19:21,120 Edward de Bono with those four words and 441 00:19:19,020 --> 00:19:24,419 using them as a provocation against each 442 00:19:21,120 --> 00:19:27,120 other he has a thinking tool where he 443 00:19:24,419 --> 00:19:29,039 introduces a random word in association 444 00:19:27,120 --> 00:19:31,500 with whatever the topic of the day is 445 00:19:29,039 --> 00:19:34,620 throw in a random word to just sort of 446 00:19:31,500 --> 00:19:36,539 you know startle your your brain kind of 447 00:19:34,620 --> 00:19:38,580 firing in a different way and it can 448 00:19:36,539 --> 00:19:40,260 spark new ideas when you just introduce 449 00:19:38,580 --> 00:19:41,820 a different 450 00:19:40,260 --> 00:19:44,160 um a different word so that's part of 451 00:19:41,820 --> 00:19:49,620 what Poe is and this idea of going 452 00:19:44,160 --> 00:19:52,620 Beyond yes and no beyond the binary 453 00:19:49,620 --> 00:19:55,500 what else and 454 00:19:52,620 --> 00:19:57,840 but ways of thinking is also also 455 00:19:55,500 --> 00:20:00,539 challenged by what open source has done 456 00:19:57,840 --> 00:20:02,160 and what agile brought when it sort of 457 00:20:00,539 --> 00:20:04,140 started to change the kind of dominant 458 00:20:02,160 --> 00:20:07,200 way of doing things right so we have to 459 00:20:04,140 --> 00:20:08,220 also interrogate the way we use our 460 00:20:07,200 --> 00:20:10,559 brains 461 00:20:08,220 --> 00:20:13,140 in our day-to-day work and not 462 00:20:10,559 --> 00:20:17,340 necessarily go for the obvious answer 463 00:20:13,140 --> 00:20:22,160 look for a second or third or fourth 464 00:20:17,340 --> 00:20:22,160 answer that could help us move forward 465 00:20:25,500 --> 00:20:31,260 so all of those things add up to 466 00:20:28,679 --> 00:20:33,179 how we organize ourselves to 467 00:20:31,260 --> 00:20:34,380 get stuff done 468 00:20:33,179 --> 00:20:37,559 or 469 00:20:34,380 --> 00:20:39,900 fancy way human Collective Endeavor gets 470 00:20:37,559 --> 00:20:42,360 stuff done I think the open source 471 00:20:39,900 --> 00:20:44,340 community and movement and 472 00:20:42,360 --> 00:20:45,600 um and all the Ever all of the openings 473 00:20:44,340 --> 00:20:47,160 that we've been talking about are an 474 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:49,320 example of human Collective Endeavor 475 00:20:47,160 --> 00:20:51,720 right we do it together and that's what 476 00:20:49,320 --> 00:20:53,880 makes it so successful 477 00:20:51,720 --> 00:20:55,740 but it's not the only thing like that so 478 00:20:53,880 --> 00:20:57,240 I wanted to kind of find a few other 479 00:20:55,740 --> 00:20:59,460 examples of 480 00:20:57,240 --> 00:21:02,940 human Collective Endeavor or getting 481 00:20:59,460 --> 00:21:06,539 stuff done or changing the world 482 00:21:02,940 --> 00:21:09,419 ending apartheid in South Africa 483 00:21:06,539 --> 00:21:11,760 there is obviously a pretty famous kind 484 00:21:09,419 --> 00:21:16,520 of figurehead for that but there was a 485 00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:16,520 real Global effort to support that work 486 00:21:18,360 --> 00:21:24,419 a recent one the United Nations has this 487 00:21:21,179 --> 00:21:27,780 historic agreement on the law of the sea 488 00:21:24,419 --> 00:21:30,720 and preserving the rain biodiversity in 489 00:21:27,780 --> 00:21:33,539 international waters so much of the the 490 00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:35,520 seas are you know associated with 491 00:21:33,539 --> 00:21:38,400 particular countries like you know the 492 00:21:35,520 --> 00:21:40,679 certain a certain distance away from our 493 00:21:38,400 --> 00:21:42,539 shores as Australian Waters but in that 494 00:21:40,679 --> 00:21:44,400 space in those in-betweens in the 495 00:21:42,539 --> 00:21:45,960 International Space they've made this 496 00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:49,260 historic agreement to treat it a bit 497 00:21:45,960 --> 00:21:52,320 like Antarctica I think it's 30 percent 498 00:21:49,260 --> 00:21:55,080 of international waters must now be 499 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:57,539 conservation zones it's huge 500 00:21:55,080 --> 00:21:59,580 so much time and effort and goodness 501 00:21:57,539 --> 00:22:01,380 knows how much bureaucracy 502 00:21:59,580 --> 00:22:04,440 to get that done 503 00:22:01,380 --> 00:22:07,020 human Collective endeavor 504 00:22:04,440 --> 00:22:10,440 the Green Revolution in India 505 00:22:07,020 --> 00:22:13,320 in the 60s 1960s 506 00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:15,720 made a massive impact on on India and 507 00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:17,760 their ability to to feed the you know 508 00:22:15,720 --> 00:22:21,240 the growing population but not just feed 509 00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:23,340 but go from a net importer to a net 510 00:22:21,240 --> 00:22:26,340 exporter huge 511 00:22:23,340 --> 00:22:29,520 but also huge negative impacts 512 00:22:26,340 --> 00:22:32,400 they've lost entire native species of 513 00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:34,740 food crops 514 00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:37,320 um it's been you know the industrial 515 00:22:34,740 --> 00:22:39,840 complex of of Agriculture has come in 516 00:22:37,320 --> 00:22:42,000 and done away with the livelihoods of of 517 00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:45,600 many farmers in India and there's been a 518 00:22:42,000 --> 00:22:47,760 real downside so it's kind of like again 519 00:22:45,600 --> 00:22:50,340 talk about revolutions and what came 520 00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:52,919 before and what needed to change the 521 00:22:50,340 --> 00:22:56,299 revolution but then 522 00:22:52,919 --> 00:22:56,299 what comes afterwards 523 00:23:00,780 --> 00:23:04,919 again the word hybrid different context 524 00:23:04,020 --> 00:23:08,280 here 525 00:23:04,919 --> 00:23:10,500 hybrids also the result of 526 00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:12,480 two things coming together and then the 527 00:23:10,500 --> 00:23:14,880 progeny not being able to have any 528 00:23:12,480 --> 00:23:16,860 future right that sort of hybrid's not 529 00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:19,380 necessarily always 530 00:23:16,860 --> 00:23:21,900 perhaps the positive buzzword that some 531 00:23:19,380 --> 00:23:25,380 might want us to think of 532 00:23:21,900 --> 00:23:28,559 also this is really stupid now but a 533 00:23:25,380 --> 00:23:31,520 liger I think a lion and a tiger anyway 534 00:23:28,559 --> 00:23:31,520 hybrids 535 00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:37,260 and this was an example of a human 536 00:23:35,159 --> 00:23:39,000 Collective Endeavor out of covert which 537 00:23:37,260 --> 00:23:41,820 I just thought was fantastic open 538 00:23:39,000 --> 00:23:43,980 Hardware collaboration the start of the 539 00:23:41,820 --> 00:23:45,600 pandemic in Australia there was no you 540 00:23:43,980 --> 00:23:46,260 know it was very hard to get 541 00:23:45,600 --> 00:23:49,380 um 542 00:23:46,260 --> 00:23:51,299 protective gear impossible in some cases 543 00:23:49,380 --> 00:23:53,400 and some enterprising humans got 544 00:23:51,299 --> 00:23:56,039 together and said how could we like make 545 00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:57,360 some of this stuff and and did laser 546 00:23:56,039 --> 00:23:58,740 cutting and design all this kind of 547 00:23:57,360 --> 00:24:02,400 stuff and came up with this which was 548 00:23:58,740 --> 00:24:04,799 really cheap and really fast to create 549 00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:06,840 the rapid shield from space tank very 550 00:24:04,799 --> 00:24:09,140 cool 551 00:24:06,840 --> 00:24:11,940 and then all of that coming together 552 00:24:09,140 --> 00:24:13,860 into ways of thinking ways of working 553 00:24:11,940 --> 00:24:16,140 and the ways of organizing all that 554 00:24:13,860 --> 00:24:17,880 effort right I wanted to call this out 555 00:24:16,140 --> 00:24:20,460 because Rusty Russell you know the 556 00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:23,100 founder of carlu a conference before the 557 00:24:20,460 --> 00:24:24,960 conference before this 558 00:24:23,100 --> 00:24:27,299 um talked about the two this he had his 559 00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:28,440 role as the trivial patch monkey and all 560 00:24:27,299 --> 00:24:30,120 these little patches that were going to 561 00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:32,460 the Linux kernel but they were so 562 00:24:30,120 --> 00:24:35,220 trivial that and and unimportant and low 563 00:24:32,460 --> 00:24:37,260 priority that they they could get missed 564 00:24:35,220 --> 00:24:39,419 so he said all right I'll gather them up 565 00:24:37,260 --> 00:24:40,860 and get them into the kernel tell me if 566 00:24:39,419 --> 00:24:42,000 I'm wrong here people who know but 567 00:24:40,860 --> 00:24:44,640 anyway 568 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:47,700 um the thing I like about this is when 569 00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:51,600 many people do one small thing those 570 00:24:47,700 --> 00:24:55,559 minis add up to a whole lot of work 571 00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:57,480 that contributes but also saves the 572 00:24:55,559 --> 00:25:00,419 effort of the people doing the heavy 573 00:24:57,480 --> 00:25:02,220 lifting and allows them to focus on what 574 00:25:00,419 --> 00:25:03,960 only they can do 575 00:25:02,220 --> 00:25:06,840 so I think why I wanted to bring this in 576 00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:09,480 is we start to Think Through open agile 577 00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:12,059 hybrid and distributed ways of 578 00:25:09,480 --> 00:25:14,460 working thinking and organizing is that 579 00:25:12,059 --> 00:25:16,440 there is a role for all of us think more 580 00:25:14,460 --> 00:25:18,179 like bees and ants you know we can all 581 00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:21,900 pick up a little piece 582 00:25:18,179 --> 00:25:23,179 and add to it it doesn't have to be the 583 00:25:21,900 --> 00:25:25,860 big 584 00:25:23,179 --> 00:25:28,919 earth-changing thing from the start but 585 00:25:25,860 --> 00:25:31,100 little things add up and and make a 586 00:25:28,919 --> 00:25:31,100 difference 587 00:25:36,960 --> 00:25:42,320 and I also asserted that this had 588 00:25:39,120 --> 00:25:42,320 literally changed everything 589 00:25:42,360 --> 00:25:49,440 and my partner said really Donna 590 00:25:45,900 --> 00:25:52,340 okay maybe just metaphorically maybe it 591 00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:52,340 hasn't changed everything 592 00:25:53,340 --> 00:25:57,720 but not everything 593 00:25:55,860 --> 00:26:00,299 is open 594 00:25:57,720 --> 00:26:03,480 and not all change is good 595 00:26:00,299 --> 00:26:05,400 and then we shared this on the socials 596 00:26:03,480 --> 00:26:09,179 and I just went oh yeah 597 00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:11,820 that tells a whole lot of stories of 598 00:26:09,179 --> 00:26:14,960 bad stuff just 599 00:26:11,820 --> 00:26:14,960 not very good things 600 00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:19,799 and there's some books over on the left 601 00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:22,140 about 602 00:26:19,799 --> 00:26:23,880 what goes into the technology that we 603 00:26:22,140 --> 00:26:26,100 use and its impacts 604 00:26:23,880 --> 00:26:28,140 and its biases 605 00:26:26,100 --> 00:26:31,080 I've always found the title ever since I 606 00:26:28,140 --> 00:26:31,919 heard of algorithms of Oppression as a 607 00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:34,320 very 608 00:26:31,919 --> 00:26:36,720 um visceral kind of reaction to that 609 00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:39,059 it's like oh yeah there's some that's a 610 00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:41,720 good way of putting some nasty framing 611 00:26:39,059 --> 00:26:44,880 up some of that nasty stuff 612 00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:47,159 algorithmic Siege on our Humanity that 613 00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:48,059 seems very dramatic but it kind of is 614 00:26:47,159 --> 00:26:50,039 right 615 00:26:48,059 --> 00:26:53,100 just saying the 616 00:26:50,039 --> 00:26:56,940 Royal commission into Robo debt 617 00:26:53,100 --> 00:26:59,580 I think that's sums that up pretty well 618 00:26:56,940 --> 00:27:03,200 so not everything is open 619 00:26:59,580 --> 00:27:03,200 and not all change is good 620 00:27:03,419 --> 00:27:06,960 so 621 00:27:04,679 --> 00:27:09,299 they're the threads that I was trying to 622 00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:12,360 kind of pull together that 623 00:27:09,299 --> 00:27:15,120 abstract at the start and this is where 624 00:27:12,360 --> 00:27:17,039 I'm going to stop doing the work 625 00:27:15,120 --> 00:27:18,000 and ask all of you to do some of the 626 00:27:17,039 --> 00:27:21,919 work 627 00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:21,919 let's examine some of these threads 628 00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:25,400 or maybe these threads 629 00:27:29,580 --> 00:27:33,080 or these threads 630 00:27:34,740 --> 00:27:40,740 so get your devices again 631 00:27:37,679 --> 00:27:43,740 and let's explore where and how these 632 00:27:40,740 --> 00:27:46,740 threads intertwine so open 633 00:27:43,740 --> 00:27:48,900 agile hybrid distributed ways of working 634 00:27:46,740 --> 00:27:50,460 thinking and organizing right that I've 635 00:27:48,900 --> 00:27:52,620 kind of set the scene for you to kind of 636 00:27:50,460 --> 00:27:54,900 have a mess in your mind 637 00:27:52,620 --> 00:27:57,840 about these things hopefully we will get 638 00:27:54,900 --> 00:27:59,700 to from mess to really nice Celtic knots 639 00:27:57,840 --> 00:28:00,900 instead of mess 640 00:27:59,700 --> 00:28:03,600 so 641 00:28:00,900 --> 00:28:04,500 bring up that 642 00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:06,480 um 643 00:28:04,500 --> 00:28:10,200 tool again 644 00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:12,600 and hopefully this time nope back 645 00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:15,559 hopefully this time it'll work 646 00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:15,559 tell me if it's not 647 00:28:17,159 --> 00:28:21,659 one participant typing okay good that's 648 00:28:19,320 --> 00:28:23,940 a signal that's a signal so how do you 649 00:28:21,659 --> 00:28:26,580 see the threads of open agile hybrid and 650 00:28:23,940 --> 00:28:28,320 distributed intertwine and how am I 651 00:28:26,580 --> 00:28:31,440 going for time 652 00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:33,240 I'm good so I'm also going to just 653 00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:36,000 encourage you to 654 00:28:33,240 --> 00:28:38,880 and I don't don't get frightened 655 00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:41,159 Talk Amongst yourselves 656 00:28:38,880 --> 00:28:43,500 so you can go straight into just 657 00:28:41,159 --> 00:28:45,360 answering the question but also huddle 658 00:28:43,500 --> 00:28:48,000 like you know just turn around the 659 00:28:45,360 --> 00:28:50,039 person next to you the person behind you 660 00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:51,480 start saying some words God I'm going to 661 00:28:50,039 --> 00:28:52,440 give you a couple of minutes and I'm 662 00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:56,480 just gonna 663 00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:56,480 hear the Zeitgeist of the room 664 00:29:05,580 --> 00:29:10,620 no talking 665 00:29:07,860 --> 00:29:13,700 typing 666 00:29:10,620 --> 00:29:13,700 all typing 667 00:29:16,799 --> 00:29:22,140 acceptance of things people places that 668 00:29:20,039 --> 00:29:25,559 are different human behavior 669 00:29:22,140 --> 00:29:28,340 you know I think I'm doing this by feel 670 00:29:25,559 --> 00:29:28,340 I see you 671 00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:34,020 do they intertwine am I like is this 672 00:29:31,860 --> 00:29:36,320 just Madness on my part 673 00:29:34,020 --> 00:29:40,020 like are they are these completely 674 00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:42,240 disconnected random things or is there 675 00:29:40,020 --> 00:29:44,520 commonality between these threads do 676 00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:47,539 they intertwine do they interconnect how 677 00:29:44,520 --> 00:29:47,539 do they impact each other 678 00:29:48,179 --> 00:29:53,580 yeah 679 00:29:50,340 --> 00:29:55,200 oh I mean it depends on its context you 680 00:29:53,580 --> 00:29:58,700 put all of the words together and then 681 00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:58,700 yes they correlate that because 682 00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:03,600 they're disgust in a way that means 683 00:30:02,820 --> 00:30:06,500 nothing 684 00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:06,500 or agile or hybrid 685 00:30:08,340 --> 00:30:13,520 yes nice 686 00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:13,520 do a summary of that 687 00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:18,720 um the context matters so all the words 688 00:30:16,559 --> 00:30:20,520 coming together have an impact and 689 00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:22,799 essentially make them a messy 690 00:30:20,520 --> 00:30:24,840 intertwined Thing by saying them all 691 00:30:22,799 --> 00:30:26,940 together looking at agile individually 692 00:30:24,840 --> 00:30:29,399 or distributed individually don't 693 00:30:26,940 --> 00:30:30,840 necessarily mean anything connected to 694 00:30:29,399 --> 00:30:32,399 each other but when you put them in a 695 00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:34,860 sentence together or in a context 696 00:30:32,399 --> 00:30:37,740 together or in a workplace together or a 697 00:30:34,860 --> 00:30:39,659 presentation or working online together 698 00:30:37,740 --> 00:30:41,520 then your brain links all of the things 699 00:30:39,659 --> 00:30:43,679 yeah the brain sort of does the magic 700 00:30:41,520 --> 00:30:45,299 doesn't it when by just by putting two 701 00:30:43,679 --> 00:30:48,480 things side by side it's going to try 702 00:30:45,299 --> 00:30:50,520 and make a connection yeah thank you 703 00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:52,140 it's like showing that behind the 704 00:30:50,520 --> 00:30:54,000 curtain there yes 705 00:30:52,140 --> 00:30:56,100 really nice all right 706 00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:57,720 I'll give you just a minute more to 707 00:30:56,100 --> 00:31:00,600 finish off if there's still kind of 708 00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:03,179 fingers tapping and thumbs thumbing 709 00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:05,940 thumbs thumbing sort of thing 710 00:31:03,179 --> 00:31:08,100 agile is something of a subset of lean 711 00:31:05,940 --> 00:31:10,980 Foss is terrific at aspects of leans 712 00:31:08,100 --> 00:31:13,919 such as eliminating waste yes and doing 713 00:31:10,980 --> 00:31:15,840 everything just in time 714 00:31:13,919 --> 00:31:17,820 humans generally work better with 715 00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:19,559 distinct rules instead of how they 716 00:31:17,820 --> 00:31:22,440 naturally would it's an interesting 717 00:31:19,559 --> 00:31:24,240 maker framework and we will follow it to 718 00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:26,100 a certain extent I like the caveat built 719 00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:27,779 in there but corporations will 720 00:31:26,100 --> 00:31:29,640 definitely enforce it and sell 721 00:31:27,779 --> 00:31:32,240 revolutions 722 00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:32,240 nice 723 00:31:32,700 --> 00:31:37,260 oh I like this 724 00:31:34,620 --> 00:31:40,080 the thread made me made me think how all 725 00:31:37,260 --> 00:31:43,260 our Tech a modern society still depends 726 00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:45,720 on a lot of very old proven and basic 727 00:31:43,260 --> 00:31:47,520 Technologies yes nice 728 00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:49,200 oh this is great thank you please feel 729 00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:50,340 free to keep going I am going to move on 730 00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:51,779 though because we're going to run out of 731 00:31:50,340 --> 00:31:52,980 time 732 00:31:51,779 --> 00:31:54,899 um 733 00:31:52,980 --> 00:31:58,140 I really 734 00:31:54,899 --> 00:32:01,679 I really wanted to 735 00:31:58,140 --> 00:32:04,380 spark some ideas and thinking and maybe 736 00:32:01,679 --> 00:32:07,080 a little bit of 737 00:32:04,380 --> 00:32:08,760 maybe a little bit of friction 738 00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:10,440 right there's there's 739 00:32:08,760 --> 00:32:12,299 a lot of assumption at something like 740 00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:14,760 this that Tech is good 741 00:32:12,299 --> 00:32:18,240 we keep hearing where it's not 742 00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:20,279 but I think we also all have 743 00:32:18,240 --> 00:32:22,440 privilege as Lindsay said this morning 744 00:32:20,279 --> 00:32:23,820 to to do something about it when it's 745 00:32:22,440 --> 00:32:26,580 not 746 00:32:23,820 --> 00:32:28,380 and I like to think that you also have 747 00:32:26,580 --> 00:32:31,740 agency 748 00:32:28,380 --> 00:32:33,539 to embark on 749 00:32:31,740 --> 00:32:37,260 doing good stuff 750 00:32:33,539 --> 00:32:39,960 so I want to leave you with 751 00:32:37,260 --> 00:32:44,059 a question 752 00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:44,059 and it was in the abstract all along 753 00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:50,760 how might we 754 00:32:48,779 --> 00:32:52,620 how might we 755 00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:54,720 not think about the problems and the 756 00:32:52,620 --> 00:32:56,580 Badness and the not everything is open 757 00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:57,419 and not all changes good but how might 758 00:32:56,580 --> 00:33:00,779 we 759 00:32:57,419 --> 00:33:03,539 continue to pursue 760 00:33:00,779 --> 00:33:07,500 positive open and inclusive change how 761 00:33:03,539 --> 00:33:09,120 might we ensure that the work we do 762 00:33:07,500 --> 00:33:13,019 is a net 763 00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:14,940 benefit to humanity and not doing bad 764 00:33:13,019 --> 00:33:17,760 stuff and 765 00:33:14,940 --> 00:33:20,820 making us cringe 766 00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:25,799 how do we do that how might we how might 767 00:33:20,820 --> 00:33:27,720 we engage in that I don't know 768 00:33:25,799 --> 00:33:30,000 but I am 769 00:33:27,720 --> 00:33:32,279 optimistic 770 00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:35,519 well I'm more than optimistic I am 771 00:33:32,279 --> 00:33:40,500 convinced that collectively 772 00:33:35,519 --> 00:33:42,960 we have the skills the values 773 00:33:40,500 --> 00:33:45,740 the capacity 774 00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:45,740 to do it 775 00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:49,039 and with that 776 00:33:49,140 --> 00:33:54,299 I want to invoke 777 00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:57,299 the great Jane Goodall primatologist 778 00:33:54,299 --> 00:33:59,460 that's famous images of her working with 779 00:33:57,299 --> 00:34:01,980 the gorillas 780 00:33:59,460 --> 00:34:03,179 um and chimp no sorry chimpanzees I'm 781 00:34:01,980 --> 00:34:05,820 going to read this I don't generally 782 00:34:03,179 --> 00:34:07,799 like reading slides but you cannot get 783 00:34:05,820 --> 00:34:11,099 through a single day without having an 784 00:34:07,799 --> 00:34:14,399 impact on the world around you 785 00:34:11,099 --> 00:34:17,099 what you do makes a difference 786 00:34:14,399 --> 00:34:18,659 but here's the important bit you have to 787 00:34:17,099 --> 00:34:22,260 decide 788 00:34:18,659 --> 00:34:26,780 what kind of difference 789 00:34:22,260 --> 00:34:26,780 you want to make 790 00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:43,369 thank you 791 00:34:37,600 --> 00:34:43,369 [Applause] 792 00:34:44,099 --> 00:34:49,200 feel free to ping me if you want to but 793 00:34:47,460 --> 00:34:50,580 we've also got a little bit of time if 794 00:34:49,200 --> 00:34:53,099 you've got any com like not just 795 00:34:50,580 --> 00:34:55,200 questions but if you've got any comments 796 00:34:53,099 --> 00:34:56,580 if you want to say Donna you're a mad 797 00:34:55,200 --> 00:34:58,740 woman what have you just put us through 798 00:34:56,580 --> 00:35:00,839 for the last half an hour that's okay 799 00:34:58,740 --> 00:35:02,280 too but like I said at the start I 800 00:35:00,839 --> 00:35:04,200 wanted to kind of get a sense of why did 801 00:35:02,280 --> 00:35:06,480 you come to this and I'm going to learn 802 00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:08,400 from that and understand that and and 803 00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:09,960 hopefully I manage to lower your 804 00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:13,200 expectations at the start so that you're 805 00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:15,480 not all really sad now 806 00:35:13,200 --> 00:35:17,460 are there any questions I would be very 807 00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:20,520 surprised if anybody in this room was 808 00:35:17,460 --> 00:35:22,260 sad after having been so challenged and 809 00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:24,180 engaged but are there questions and 810 00:35:22,260 --> 00:35:27,680 comments and engagements and 811 00:35:24,180 --> 00:35:27,680 provocations for Donna now 812 00:35:31,140 --> 00:35:35,760 [Music] 813 00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:36,839 um that was fantastic Donna thank you I 814 00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:38,880 was really excited when I read this 815 00:35:36,839 --> 00:35:41,160 abstract and reviewing it and 816 00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:42,900 but expectations met and exceeded 817 00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:46,320 fantastic thank you 818 00:35:42,900 --> 00:35:49,260 um uh you mentioned like ways of 819 00:35:46,320 --> 00:35:51,540 thinking and coming up with different 820 00:35:49,260 --> 00:35:55,320 answers and continuing to try and think 821 00:35:51,540 --> 00:35:57,060 of answers but I also think and this 822 00:35:55,320 --> 00:35:59,099 presentation is a really good example of 823 00:35:57,060 --> 00:36:02,220 this is coming up with different 824 00:35:59,099 --> 00:36:04,800 questions yes framing right is also 825 00:36:02,220 --> 00:36:08,220 about ways of thinking and applying 826 00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:09,599 different people's perspectives to the 827 00:36:08,220 --> 00:36:12,480 work you're doing or the problem you're 828 00:36:09,599 --> 00:36:14,099 trying to solve is just as important if 829 00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:15,420 not more so than just coming up with 830 00:36:14,099 --> 00:36:16,740 different answers to the same old 831 00:36:15,420 --> 00:36:20,160 question 832 00:36:16,740 --> 00:36:22,980 yes and and what you've just said also 833 00:36:20,160 --> 00:36:25,280 makes me think about how too often we 834 00:36:22,980 --> 00:36:27,900 don't think enough about the problem 835 00:36:25,280 --> 00:36:30,060 before we start to solve it and 836 00:36:27,900 --> 00:36:32,579 sometimes we assume we have an answer or 837 00:36:30,060 --> 00:36:34,140 a solution and some of my colleagues are 838 00:36:32,579 --> 00:36:36,480 really good at like we've got the 839 00:36:34,140 --> 00:36:38,339 solution to all your problems 840 00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:40,020 didn't I shouldn't I was recording I 841 00:36:38,339 --> 00:36:42,240 should be careful should be careful but 842 00:36:40,020 --> 00:36:45,180 but do we actually understand the 843 00:36:42,240 --> 00:36:47,040 problems that we're trying to tackle do 844 00:36:45,180 --> 00:36:49,859 we spend enough time I think Einstein's 845 00:36:47,040 --> 00:36:51,660 got a really famous kind of um quip 846 00:36:49,859 --> 00:36:53,520 about you know spending you know you're 847 00:36:51,660 --> 00:36:55,380 going to spend 95 of the time on the 848 00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:57,960 problem or something before you try and 849 00:36:55,380 --> 00:37:00,300 find the answer but I think like you say 850 00:36:57,960 --> 00:37:02,520 you've got to ask more questions to 851 00:37:00,300 --> 00:37:04,980 uncover what it is that we're actually 852 00:37:02,520 --> 00:37:07,560 trying to solve and not go chasing a 853 00:37:04,980 --> 00:37:10,200 solution to the wrong thing yeah thank 854 00:37:07,560 --> 00:37:12,240 you you David nice one 855 00:37:10,200 --> 00:37:15,720 Tatiana 856 00:37:12,240 --> 00:37:19,740 and Fiona running with the mic 857 00:37:15,720 --> 00:37:22,619 um I had a lawyer ask me this so and in 858 00:37:19,740 --> 00:37:24,599 a way I quickly gave an answer but then 859 00:37:22,619 --> 00:37:27,720 I really really thought about it 860 00:37:24,599 --> 00:37:30,599 afterwards so I I'll just 861 00:37:27,720 --> 00:37:33,480 so we were basically proposing a 862 00:37:30,599 --> 00:37:35,880 solution to someone 863 00:37:33,480 --> 00:37:38,820 you know and she said well in what way 864 00:37:35,880 --> 00:37:40,619 is it better than a lawyer sitting down 865 00:37:38,820 --> 00:37:42,980 with them and going through their 866 00:37:40,619 --> 00:37:47,099 problem with them and then you know 867 00:37:42,980 --> 00:37:50,040 giving them you know like an appropriate 868 00:37:47,099 --> 00:37:53,400 kind of response and maybe a legal 869 00:37:50,040 --> 00:37:56,339 remedy to go with it and my quick answer 870 00:37:53,400 --> 00:37:58,760 was you know well you know nothing can 871 00:37:56,339 --> 00:38:02,460 replace that individual human attention 872 00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:05,820 you know but you can scale that with 873 00:38:02,460 --> 00:38:08,760 technology but then I thought no maybe 874 00:38:05,820 --> 00:38:10,680 there are other answers to this so I 875 00:38:08,760 --> 00:38:12,960 would love to hear from you or from 876 00:38:10,680 --> 00:38:15,920 anyone in the audience like what those 877 00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:15,920 answers might be 878 00:38:21,780 --> 00:38:28,520 wow so for the recording what's better 879 00:38:24,839 --> 00:38:28,520 than individual human retention 880 00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:36,420 for providing a technical solution 881 00:38:32,880 --> 00:38:37,740 yeah good it's a good question I in some 882 00:38:36,420 --> 00:38:41,359 ways I think 883 00:38:37,740 --> 00:38:41,359 there it's not that it's better 884 00:38:41,820 --> 00:38:47,280 um you know Tatiana and I were talking 885 00:38:44,940 --> 00:38:48,480 um so I had a bit of insight into the 886 00:38:47,280 --> 00:38:50,760 system that she's sort of talking about 887 00:38:48,480 --> 00:38:54,060 and creating 888 00:38:50,760 --> 00:38:55,980 um like uh creating an application an 889 00:38:54,060 --> 00:38:58,560 app that can help people get some very 890 00:38:55,980 --> 00:39:00,960 basic legal kind of 891 00:38:58,560 --> 00:39:03,300 um guidance through various processes 892 00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:05,160 and and stuff rather than having to call 893 00:39:03,300 --> 00:39:06,540 a helpline to get that individual 894 00:39:05,160 --> 00:39:07,800 attention right so that's the context 895 00:39:06,540 --> 00:39:10,200 that I understand you're sort of 896 00:39:07,800 --> 00:39:13,020 referring to there and I think it's like 897 00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:16,619 is it better not necessarily but does it 898 00:39:13,020 --> 00:39:18,599 free people to do other things 899 00:39:16,619 --> 00:39:20,820 then yeah so it's not that it's it's 900 00:39:18,599 --> 00:39:23,160 better for that person but it's maybe 901 00:39:20,820 --> 00:39:25,740 giving them a quick response and saving 902 00:39:23,160 --> 00:39:27,240 resources in in other ways so I think 903 00:39:25,740 --> 00:39:28,560 that also speaks to the have we 904 00:39:27,240 --> 00:39:30,180 understood the problem like if someone 905 00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:32,640 said well how is that better than it's 906 00:39:30,180 --> 00:39:35,099 like well is that the best question to 907 00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:35,940 tease out what they're trying to you 908 00:39:35,099 --> 00:39:38,040 know how they're trying to understand 909 00:39:35,940 --> 00:39:40,560 what it is you're working with I think 910 00:39:38,040 --> 00:39:42,599 that's a really interesting question yes 911 00:39:40,560 --> 00:39:44,099 yeah please 912 00:39:42,599 --> 00:39:46,619 um I was just thinking about this from 913 00:39:44,099 --> 00:39:49,320 our context we get um people come to us 914 00:39:46,619 --> 00:39:51,599 with uh uh I I want this technical 915 00:39:49,320 --> 00:39:53,280 solution and maybe um we have to have 916 00:39:51,599 --> 00:39:54,599 those one-on-one conversations and I'm 917 00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:56,400 like but what are you actually trying to 918 00:39:54,599 --> 00:39:58,079 achieve I get that you want a virtual 919 00:39:56,400 --> 00:39:59,579 machine and you want 12 gig of RAM and 920 00:39:58,079 --> 00:40:00,720 someone's told you that you need 100 Gig 921 00:39:59,579 --> 00:40:02,579 of space but what are you actually 922 00:40:00,720 --> 00:40:04,440 trying to do because maybe that's 923 00:40:02,579 --> 00:40:06,000 technology is not the best solution for 924 00:40:04,440 --> 00:40:07,560 you and just extrapolating out on what 925 00:40:06,000 --> 00:40:10,320 you're thinking about with the lawyer 926 00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:12,420 having the one-on-one I feel like the 927 00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:15,060 growth and asking the questions and 928 00:40:12,420 --> 00:40:16,680 discussion and conversation is the best 929 00:40:15,060 --> 00:40:18,180 way of getting a response to things 930 00:40:16,680 --> 00:40:20,040 because everybody has a different point 931 00:40:18,180 --> 00:40:21,599 of view so I would challenge that better 932 00:40:20,040 --> 00:40:24,060 than having the one-on-one with the 933 00:40:21,599 --> 00:40:25,380 lawyer would be a community or a group 934 00:40:24,060 --> 00:40:28,320 conversation where you're going to get 935 00:40:25,380 --> 00:40:30,359 diverse views and diverse perspectives 936 00:40:28,320 --> 00:40:32,339 and diverse information and knowledge 937 00:40:30,359 --> 00:40:34,320 sets so that it opens up a conversation 938 00:40:32,339 --> 00:40:35,640 so that maybe the information or the 939 00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:38,160 problem that they're trying to solve 940 00:40:35,640 --> 00:40:39,660 would be more well informed from 941 00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:41,280 different people within the group as 942 00:40:39,660 --> 00:40:43,680 opposed to one specialized lawyer in 943 00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:47,000 this instance 944 00:40:43,680 --> 00:40:47,000 um thank you yes 945 00:40:47,099 --> 00:40:52,440 but extending from that is the that's 946 00:40:49,380 --> 00:40:53,880 still a human resourcing it's bringing 947 00:40:52,440 --> 00:40:55,500 together a community of people in the 948 00:40:53,880 --> 00:40:58,079 same space at the same time and having 949 00:40:55,500 --> 00:41:00,060 experts in that time and space it has 950 00:40:58,079 --> 00:41:02,160 limitations whereas the technical 951 00:41:00,060 --> 00:41:03,900 solution broadens the equity of 952 00:41:02,160 --> 00:41:07,440 accessing that same information more 953 00:41:03,900 --> 00:41:09,900 quickly maybe not as strongly or as 954 00:41:07,440 --> 00:41:11,520 understood way but I think the equity 955 00:41:09,900 --> 00:41:14,520 element is so important in that space 956 00:41:11,520 --> 00:41:16,740 yes nice well said the equity like it's 957 00:41:14,520 --> 00:41:18,300 again not better but is it is it you 958 00:41:16,740 --> 00:41:20,760 know broadening access and giving more 959 00:41:18,300 --> 00:41:22,560 people the ability to to to get the 960 00:41:20,760 --> 00:41:25,040 benefit of that service or offering yeah 961 00:41:22,560 --> 00:41:25,040 nice one 962 00:41:25,140 --> 00:41:30,480 thank you Donna for you know what I feel 963 00:41:27,900 --> 00:41:33,599 like you got the best slot of the 964 00:41:30,480 --> 00:41:36,240 conference because this is like this 965 00:41:33,599 --> 00:41:38,220 thread is just winding it all up and 966 00:41:36,240 --> 00:41:41,460 bringing in so many different kinds of 967 00:41:38,220 --> 00:41:45,000 open so I mean nice work with the 968 00:41:41,460 --> 00:41:45,000 programming and 969 00:41:45,140 --> 00:41:51,839 [Laughter] 970 00:41:49,500 --> 00:41:55,200 so um also this is going to be a bit 971 00:41:51,839 --> 00:41:57,660 more of a comment than a question 972 00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:59,880 um or perhaps it's a reflection 973 00:41:57,660 --> 00:42:01,380 um it it pinged in my mind when you 974 00:41:59,880 --> 00:42:04,079 started that first question about when 975 00:42:01,380 --> 00:42:06,660 did this start was it you know in the 976 00:42:04,079 --> 00:42:10,020 70s or the 80s or way back in the 977 00:42:06,660 --> 00:42:12,240 primordial soup or all of the above I 978 00:42:10,020 --> 00:42:13,980 really like the olive the above part 979 00:42:12,240 --> 00:42:16,200 because 980 00:42:13,980 --> 00:42:18,839 um that's true like we're always 981 00:42:16,200 --> 00:42:21,960 beginning we're always becoming and and 982 00:42:18,839 --> 00:42:25,079 that actually is a um from my experience 983 00:42:21,960 --> 00:42:28,320 is a thread in queer theory about like 984 00:42:25,079 --> 00:42:30,900 identity is not static it it is always a 985 00:42:28,320 --> 00:42:34,320 process of becoming and that's what I 986 00:42:30,900 --> 00:42:36,060 think that we're we're doing here even 987 00:42:34,320 --> 00:42:38,220 though we like to shy away from that 988 00:42:36,060 --> 00:42:39,780 idea of reinvent let's not reinvent the 989 00:42:38,220 --> 00:42:42,780 wheel 990 00:42:39,780 --> 00:42:45,540 by putting attention into that sort of 991 00:42:42,780 --> 00:42:47,760 that Center of where our values are you 992 00:42:45,540 --> 00:42:50,040 know that that kind of pulling look at 993 00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:52,500 attending to that gravity I think that 994 00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:56,160 can be a really useful kind of magnet 995 00:42:52,500 --> 00:43:00,240 around you know what our 996 00:42:56,160 --> 00:43:02,700 what our attention orbits nice gravity 997 00:43:00,240 --> 00:43:06,180 magnets and attention orbiting very nice 998 00:43:02,700 --> 00:43:08,099 but not I I I it's not a question and a 999 00:43:06,180 --> 00:43:09,119 comment but I I really I like the way 1000 00:43:08,099 --> 00:43:11,460 that you've kind of brought those 1001 00:43:09,119 --> 00:43:13,619 elements together because 1002 00:43:11,460 --> 00:43:16,079 you know too much of what we do at a 1003 00:43:13,619 --> 00:43:18,060 conference like this is is just a sort 1004 00:43:16,079 --> 00:43:20,520 of wind like a like the play school 1005 00:43:18,060 --> 00:43:22,680 Windows into a particular world 1006 00:43:20,520 --> 00:43:26,099 and I am I was kind of glad that I got 1007 00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:27,240 the last slot to be able to kind of draw 1008 00:43:26,099 --> 00:43:30,359 on 1009 00:43:27,240 --> 00:43:32,700 what I've seen through those windows 1010 00:43:30,359 --> 00:43:36,000 um yeah so no thank you I think that's 1011 00:43:32,700 --> 00:43:38,220 that's really nice thank you 1012 00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:40,319 well we are at time 1013 00:43:38,220 --> 00:43:42,420 um so I hope you will continue all of 1014 00:43:40,319 --> 00:43:43,800 these conversations over afternoon tea 1015 00:43:42,420 --> 00:43:45,800 but please join with me in thanking 1016 00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:48,450 Donna one more time 1017 00:43:45,800 --> 00:43:53,060 thank you 1018 00:43:48,450 --> 00:43:53,060 [Applause]